Science Under Siege: A Talk With Peter Hotez and Michael Mann

Lysenko comes to America | Paul Krugman | Sep 6 2025

Peter Hotez, who has done yeoman work defending vaccines, and Michael Mann, a hero of the climate change wars, have a new book about the assault on science. I spoke with them and emerged both enlightened and frightened. Transcript follows:

TRANSCRIPT:
Paul Krugman in Conversation with Hotez and Mann

(recorded 9/03/25)

Paul Krugman: Hi, folks. Paul Krugman again. This time I’m going to actually talk to two people, Peter Hotez and Michael Mann, who are both distinguished scientists and public policy figures. They have a new book which will be coming out a couple of days after this goes up called Science Under Siege. Peter is a pediatrician and research scientist and has been very involved in the vaccine debates.

Michael E. Mann whom I’ve known, at least digitally for a long time, is a climatologist. And both have been subject to a lot of personal attacks. And who knew that science was going to be quite so thrilling and dangerous? Hi guys, welcome to this interview format.

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